Predefinição Discussão:Europa/li

Último comentário: 27 de outubro de 2009 de Ooswesthoesbes no tópico Spelling errors in the list

Spelling errors in the list editar

Hello Portuguese-speaking colleagues,

Unfortunately this list currently contains more errors than correct terms. Now that most of these pages haven't been created yet it's better to fix it. A correct list of Limburgish European countries can be found here. --Ooswesthoesbes 15h44min de 23 de outubro de 2009 (UTC)Responder

Are you saying that the Limburgish Wikipedia (on what our list is based) is wrong? It does have entries for Andorra, Azerbaidzjan, Esland, etc and not for Andórre, Azerbeizjaan, Èslandj...
--Valdir Jorge  fala!       
Liberdade sim, anarquia não! ;-) 16h22min de 23 de outubro de 2009 (UTC)Responder
Yes. It's difficult to explain in a short time, but let's say that Limburgish has about 500 dialects. At li.wikip they use one spelling per dialect, so that's 500 spellings. This causes the problem that there are over five different dialects are used on this template. (note Sjlovenië ends on -ië, while ends on Sjlowakieë -ieë)
At li.wikt, li.wikiq and li.wikisource we've decided to use the Hoeaglèmbörgsj standardisation (other spellings are still welcome, but to keep everything clear we use one form on our templates). I think pt.wikt could also better do this. Alternative spellings like Andorra and Sjpanje can be listed at the pages Andórre and Spanje (and could also have a seperate article which can include which dialect is it), but for main templates like these it's better to use the standardisation.
(sorry for this fast explanation, but I have little time right now) --Ooswesthoesbes 16h28min de 23 de outubro de 2009 (UTC)Responder
I do understand all the concern about different dialects mixed in one template, but, as Valdir Jorge said, the template was based on the information displayed on li.Wikipedia and there should be a consensus about what dialect should be used to make all articles uniform. Maybe the best thing to do here is to bring the point to our forum and discuss what we shall do: follow strictly li.Wikipedia and leave the template as it is, or correct everything according to one dialect (I don't know if this is the best thing to be done; maybe leave the template as it is and write all the alternatives below the definition is also a good way to include all dialects, but our colleagues from nl.Wikt will have to tell us all the alternative forms of all countries). Anyway, thanks for the cooperation and let's study the case closely. -- Isaac Mansur 17h11min de 23 de outubro de 2009 (UTC)Responder
Nl.wikt only uses Hoeaglèmbörgsj and doesn't give any alternatives. The current state of this template isn't really something good. The first five terms are "Huillands" (mixed Limburgish and Dutch), then we get Maastrichts, again Huillands, then probably some Belgian dialect, Cyprus is Dutch, the following six terms are probably Maastrichts, then we get some northern dialect, Ierland is Dutch, Iesland is Maastrichtian, then again four terms written in Huillands, Litouwe would be some southern or northern dialect, followed by six terms Huillands, Nederlandj is a quite general term used throughout Limburg, then we get four times Maastrichtian, Portugal is Dutch, then four times Maastrichtian, Sjlovenië is Valkenburgs, Sjlowakieë is a west-central dialect (or Belgian), Sjpanje is Valkenburgs, Turkije is Dutch, Tsjechië could be Noorbeeks or some other southern dialect, then we get Valkenburgs, then there's two times Maastrichtian, Zjwaede isn't Limburgish and definitely not Dutch, Zjwitserland could be Valkenburgs.
As you can see this template is a mess. Some words aren't even any Limburgish dialect (some pages at li.wp use Dutch names when they are written in more than one dialect so that could be the reason). Putting this template in one dialect would be very hard, first you need to chose one of the 500 leaving probably over 95% of all speakers' pronunciation not written down. As I already said it would be the best to take the standardisation. This is used at li.wikt, nl.wikt, is.wikt, no.wikt, sv.wikt, ja.wikt and so on.
My advice as a native speaker is first to put this template in Hoeaglèmbörgsj and create those pages and the next step would be to write down at the already existing pages (like Sjpanje) in what dialect they are written. Then you could link those pages to eachother and the problem is solved. --Ooswesthoesbes 17h36min de 23 de outubro de 2009 (UTC)Responder

Bem, eu, particularmente, concordo com o Ooswesthoesbes. Eu acho que o melhor é manter uma uniformidade na predefinição, pois não acho legal a ideia de se fazer uma mistura de vários dialetos. Mas eu não participo do porjeto países e não conheço nada de limburguês, então não sei se minha opinião conta muito..

(Well, I, particularly, agree with Ooswesthoesbes. I think that it's better to keep an uniformity in the tamplate, beacause I don't like the idea of mixing a lot of dialects. But, I don't take part in the "project countries" and I kwnow nothing about Well, I, particularly, agree with Ooswesthoesbes. I think that it's better to keep an uniformity in the tamplate, beacause I don't like the idea of mixing a lot of dialects. But, I don't take part in the "project countries" and I kwnow nothing about Limburgish, so I don't know if my opinion hold good., so I don't know if my opinion hold good.) --Jesiel通信 17h47min de 23 de outubro de 2009 (UTC)Responder

I agree with the standardsation as well. If li.Wikipedia brings dutch alternatives and also some other dialects, let's use what Ooswesthoesbes is telling us. He is a native speaker and is trying to help, that is a great thing! :-) -- Isaac Mansur 18h08min de 23 de outubro de 2009 (UTC)Responder
I'm also for uniformisation. Malafaya 21h44min de 23 de outubro de 2009 (UTC)Responder

Are there also templates for the other continents? --Ooswesthoesbes 10h47min de 24 de outubro de 2009 (UTC)Responder

Yes, see Predefinição:África/li and Predefinição:Ásia/li. They were also based on the Limburgish wikipedia, so I imagine that they suffer of the same problem.
Do you have the templates for Oceania and America as well?
--Valdir Jorge  fala!       
Liberdade sim, anarquia não! ;-) 10h51min de 24 de outubro de 2009 (UTC)Responder
Yes, those two templates are even worse.. This is Asia, this is Africa, this is America. We don't have Oceania yet, but I'll try to make that one too :) --Ooswesthoesbes 10h58min de 24 de outubro de 2009 (UTC)Responder
Here's the template of Oceania. --Ooswesthoesbes 11h15min de 24 de outubro de 2009 (UTC)Responder

Have you already made a decision? --Ooswesthoesbes 06h47min de 26 de outubro de 2009 (UTC)Responder

Thanks for the links to the other templates.
As for a decision, yes, I think the consensus is to defer to you, considering that you are a native speaker of the language.
--Valdir Jorge  fala!
Liberdade sim, anarquia não! 08h03min de 26 de outubro de 2009 (UTC)Responder
Ok. If you need any help, you can always ask me :) --Ooswesthoesbes 09h50min de 26 de outubro de 2009 (UTC)Responder

I've replaced your list. You can get all your information from li.wikt (all articles have maps which show the geographic location). Vatikaanstad = the vatican and Vereinig Keuninkriek = united kingdom. --Ooswesthoesbes 05h14min de 27 de outubro de 2009 (UTC)Responder

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